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Old Dec 30, 2013, 3:20am   #331
darryl
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Has anyone seen the movie Computer Chess?
I thought it would be like a Christopher Guest type movie. Well, I was disappointed. I just thought it was pretty bad. It's slow moving, the characters don't really get developed and it's really not even funny. Even the scenes with the swingers are just kind of awkward. It would be far more interesting to be an actual documentary. Maybe I missed the point.

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Old Feb 07, 2014, 10:23pm   #332
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this Carlsen\Nakamura game is pretty interesting I know I would snap play D6
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Old Feb 08, 2014, 12:31pm   #333
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d6 on which move? watching an 18 minute video to figure that out seems excessive.

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Old Feb 08, 2014, 5:15pm   #334
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This position white to move, d6 seem to just flat out win a piece which it does but it actually opens the door to a remarkable swindle. d6 is one of the worst moves for white. Turns out black is basically in zugzwang and white would be better of just playing a waiting move with the queen or ka2

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Old Feb 08, 2014, 6:33pm   #335
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so...d6 Nxd6 Nxd6 Rd8 Nmoves Rd1+ Ka2 Qe6+ Kb2 Qb6 and mate follows?

we can take the b6 square away with Nc8 after Rd8, in which case Kxg7 and white can maybe hold with Ne7...lot of pawns to deal with but i don't see a knockout from there...Rd1+ Ka2 Qe6+ Qxe6 fxe6 Rh6 Rd7 Nc8 then what? not the easiest endgame for white but it's not dead.

time was presumably a factor here. no way a master misses that if i saw it so quickly.

1,Qg4 threatening Rh6 anyway.

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Old Feb 08, 2014, 6:50pm   #336
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Yeah Basically. Nakamura even missed Nc8, played Nc4.
Computers basically say d6 went from forced win to somewhat even.
Nakamura was in time pressure

Why the position is kind of unique is its a middle game zugzwang.
After almost any move but 1.d6, and black just loses.

Say 1. Ka2, black cant move queen or rook, Nd6 just loses the knight other knight moves allows d6, and moving the b pawn allows for the d6 and now blacks queen is blocked from joining any attack on whites king through the b file.

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Old Feb 08, 2014, 8:15pm   #337
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyjoejoejr View Post
Yeah Basically. Nakamura even missed Nc8, played Nc4.
mm. when this kind of thing happens it's usually because the master has seen something you missed rather than the other way round,

Quote:
Computers basically say d6 went from forced win to somewhat even.
forced win is a bit strong. +- certainly. i'd say after the line i have, the position is =+, possibly -+ and conceivably but almost certainly not =.

Quote:
Why the position is kind of unique is its a middle game zugzwang.
depends on how you define zugzwang. most people use it to mean "whatever i do i'm fucked", in which case any forced mate is zz. i prefer to reserve it for positions where the player loses if he must move but draws if he can pass.

Quote:
Say 1. Ka2, black cant move queen or rook, Nd6 just loses the knight other knight moves allows d6, and moving the b pawn allows for the d6 and now blacks queen is blocked from joining any attack on whites king through the b file.
sure, but how many times are you going to pass with your king? black still has positive moves here. 1.Ka2 b5 2.Ka1 b4 3.Ka2 b3+ 4.Nxa3 and black is ahead. so what actually happens is, after b5 white plays something else like Qf1, breaking his attack and allowing black to move some other stuff. black is going to lose but people lose all the time.

so yeah, crush crush crush blunder lose. pretty standard tbh

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