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Old Mar 08, 2004, 11:41pm   #1
Semo
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Default NL tourney, no value in AA

Hey,
I keep seeing the same thing in some single table NL tourneys. I see this in early play, not late play, not too bad a move in late play. People will go all-in with AA, then show them when all others fold. Then the whole table starts talking about how bad AA sucks. They say they do that because they are tired of the suckouts. Sure they do loose occasionally, as do any other starters. Why do they waste a great hand by getting no value out of it. They then play AK and hit an A or K then play them for value. I am glad they do that while I am at the table, but cmon playing aces is not that sucky of a task. Why not put in a nice raise, get them a little gunshy of drawing and maybe....actually win some chips, which is my objective when I am in a tourney. Anyone else notice this play with aces.
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Old Mar 09, 2004, 12:07am   #2
Mercy
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Another way to play AA is to try to provoke a reraise preflop. Then you can put them all-in. Playing it a little slow sometimes isn't bad either. Maybe someone else hits their top pair on the flop and you can get them all-in then.
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Old Mar 09, 2004, 12:20am   #3
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I disagree with the previous post. I've seen it far too often in NL tournaments where people will slow play aces, and someone will catch 3 of a kind on the flop, or have a straight and/or a flush draw and will hit. I would advise any time you have pocket aces to put in a good size raise, and play it strongly. But I agree with the first post, people do lose with pocket aces, but if you play it correctly, its a hand that will win often. Go all-in with it pre-flop is useless.
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Old Mar 09, 2004, 2:31am   #4
Mercy
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Well, certainly don't just call the BB, but if your limp-raise is only called then it's not so bad because you might be able to bust a top pair, either by zapping it out of him or going all-in (depending on stack size). Could he draw out on you? Sure, thats the risk you are taking. And that's why you shouldn't limp-raise all the time, just do it for variety.

I would say that if your opponents are very passive, i.e. you won't get reraises preflop, or very loose, i.e. you'll get lots of runners, then go ahead and raise strong to begin with. The ideal situation is to limp-raise and get them to play back at you with a pair or AK, then you put them all-in preflop
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Old Mar 18, 2004, 10:46pm   #5
engstrok
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I laugh every time someone gets nothing early in a tourney for an inordinately huge pre-flop raise with aces. But one reason I think you see this behavior and the ensuing "let me tell you about the times I got bad beat on pocket aces" stories is that when people have aces, they assume that no matter how they play it they should just be given the pot since it's the best starting hand. People need to focus more on the concept that it's the best STARTING hand, not the best HAND. If the game were played solely on the two cards you were dealt, it wouldn't be much of a game, now would it?

I also think the people who complain about losing with aces can't imagine the idea of getting away from them if they see a scary flop, turn, or river. It's like if some people have pocket aces, they forget the concept of anything beyond top pair ever winning a pot. Also, you rarely hear about the times people have aces and win with them cause people expect to win with them. You never hear anyone say "Man, I really stuck it this guy when I had him totally overmatched pre-flop with aces" cause that's what people expect to happen, so it's not a big deal. Nobody remembers winning a pot with aces even half as clearly as they remember losing a pot with aces.
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Old Mar 19, 2004, 10:45pm   #6
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With aces, you have two choices- you can gamble or you can win a small pot.

Now, if someone has KK or if it's late and someone has AK and is aggressive, you can maybe get all in preflop. But if you wanna bust someone with AA, you probably have to put in a standard raise or just limp and then see the flop and hope to bust top pair.

In a ring game, you have to be more careful b/c your stack is much larger in relation to the blinds. If you get a lot of action at the flop, either that player is on a huge draw or they have you beat- basically you don't have that player soundly beat like you do someone with top pair.

But I'm more willing to gamble with aces in a tournament. I'll sometimes just call a raise in order to trap him if I'm fairly low-medium stacked. Has this backfired? Of course. Many times someone flops top two and busts me out, but I'm generally low stacked and need to double up at the time. Thus, I'm willing to gamble and risk a bad flop in the hopes of doubling up through a big pair.

So, in a tournament. If you have a large/medium large stack, you shouldn't gamble much b/c you don't need to (unless your opponent/opponents are alls mall stacks and you can risk a hit). However, if you are a smallish stack and really need to double up, you shoul consider slowplaying it, just calling a raise or trying for a limp raise, or just making a small/standard raise. You may bust out, but you probably won't and you need to double up anyway!
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Old Mar 25, 2004, 5:25am   #7
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Things that may be considered.

Early in a tourney, the idiots are still in...and they have prized money. A lot of times random allins are called by folks with any ace, or 55 or some other marginal hand.

I personally subscribe to the "try and lure them in" strategy.
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