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Old Mar 22, 2007, 7:27pm   #21
JJS6866
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Originally Posted by cetacean View Post
Does everyone else have days/weeks/months where they repeatedly lose as favorites? Yes.

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Does everyone else repeatedly attribute their successes to good play and their losses to bad luck?

...

What do you attribute your success to if not good play? I realize the term "good play" is extremely subjective and we can argue all day over what is good and what isn't. If I post in this forum again I will choose my words very carefully. When someone hits running suited cards to beat me after I flop top set and they call my all in with 3rd pair...that is bad luck I don't care what anyone says.
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Old Mar 22, 2007, 7:43pm   #22
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Originally Posted by JJS6866 View Post
What do you attribute your success to if not good play? I realize the term "good play" is extremely subjective and we can argue all day over what is good and what isn't. If I post in this forum again I will choose my words very carefully. When someone hits running suited cards to beat me after I flop top set and they call my all in with 3rd pair...that is bad luck I don't care what anyone says.
Poker is a game of skill AND luck. Get your money in when you are ahead, and be happy when they call you when they are behind. You should be happy with your good play, not bitter with your bad luck.

If you can't embrace that, then you are in for a lot of bad times.
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Old Mar 22, 2007, 8:01pm   #23
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There are lots of obvious forms of luck, and we do a good job of recognizing those. There are also lots of more subtle forms of luck that, when we win, we easily ignore.

For example, I have KK on the button, I raise and the BB calls. Flop comes 9 high, BB checks, I check behind. Turn comes a Q and BB bets out, I raise and blah blah blah. I end up winning the hand with KK to his Q7 or the like.

Let's say that he would have folded if I bet the flop. Since I checked and showed weakness, he bet out and I ended up making some nice cash. I got lucky there that he hit something on that turn. Lots of people will look at this saying "I played that well to extract some value" not realizing that if the turn had come a blank, the action would have gone check, bet, fold.

What's my point? In any individual tournament, let alone any small series of hands within a tourney, it's very difficult if not impossible to determine whether success is due to skill, obvious luck (AA vs. KK all in pre flop), or more subtle luck (when you had KK the donkey got dealt Ax and played it instead of the rock getting it who would have folded it)
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Old Mar 22, 2007, 8:47pm   #24
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When someone hits running suited cards to beat me after I flop top set and they call my all in with 3rd pair...that is bad luck I don't care what anyone says.
Right...

but when you see a flop after you should have pushed preflop and two overs end up beating a pocket pair... is that bad luck?
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Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?
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Old Mar 22, 2007, 8:57pm   #25
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Originally Posted by JJS6866 View Post
What do you attribute your success to if not good play? I realize the term "good play" is extremely subjective and we can argue all day over what is good and what isn't. If I post in this forum again I will choose my words very carefully. When someone hits running suited cards to beat me after I flop top set and they call my all in with 3rd pair...that is bad luck I don't care what anyone says.
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Old Mar 22, 2007, 10:08pm   #26
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Nice title!
Nope, most people dont lose coin flips

raising half your stack PF is usually not that good.
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Old Mar 23, 2007, 12:21am   #27
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When someone hits running suited cards to beat me after I flop top set and they call my all in with 3rd pair...that is bad luck I don't care what anyone says.
This is along the same lines as what MikeD said, but no.... when you have top set and someone calls with a weaker hand, that is GOOD luck. What happens next is immaterial.
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