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Old Aug 03, 2010, 10:59pm   #1
SwoopAE
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Default 100PLO Rush River Spot

I talked myself into a fold, then a call and as I went to hit the call button I timed out. Now I think it's probably a fold again.

Thoughts on call/fold on the river? Also on flop/turn line if you think I did anything wrong

Full Tilt Poker Game #22810079295: Table Vroom (6 max) - $0.50/$1 - Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 18:34:14 ET - 2010/08/03
Seat 1: WinterKing ($145.05)
Seat 2: MATEIN5 ($62.65)
Seat 3: bbangsangman ($59.60)
Seat 4: SwoopAE ($659.20)
Seat 5: Khaki Pants ($110.65)
Seat 6: Laurent Gonay ($89.80)
Khaki Pants posts the small blind of $0.50
Laurent Gonay posts the big blind of $1
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SwoopAE [3c Th Ad Ac]
WinterKing calls $1
MATEIN5 folds
bbangsangman folds
SwoopAE raises to $4.50
Khaki Pants folds
Laurent Gonay calls $3.50
WinterKing calls $3.50
*** FLOP *** [Tc 8c 8d]
Laurent Gonay checks
WinterKing bets $7
SwoopAE calls $7
Laurent Gonay calls $7
*** TURN *** [Tc 8c 8d] [Qc]
Laurent Gonay checks
WinterKing checks
SwoopAE bets $22
Laurent Gonay has 15 seconds left to act
Laurent Gonay folds
WinterKing calls $22
*** RIVER *** [Tc 8c 8d Qc] [3s]
WinterKing bets $79
SwoopAE has 15 seconds left to act
SwoopAE has timed out
SwoopAE folds
Uncalled bet of $79 returned to WinterKing
WinterKing mucks
WinterKing wins the pot ($76)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $79 | Rake $3
Board: [Tc 8c 8d Qc 3s]
Seat 1: WinterKing collected ($76), mucked
Seat 2: MATEIN5 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: bbangsangman didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: SwoopAE (button) folded on the River
Seat 5: Khaki Pants (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 6: Laurent Gonay (big blind) folded on the Turn
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Last edited by SwoopAE; Aug 03, 2010 at 11:05pm.
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Old Aug 03, 2010, 11:54pm   #2
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I'll try taking another stab. I'm sure I'll get yelled at again, but that's what I need

I would have raised the flop. You've got the over pair with the nut flush draw. Sure the board is paired, and he may have an eight. Being that you have a ten, it's less likely he has TT or 8T. Still, if he reraises hard, you could probably fold since you are probably drawing to two aces some of which are probably out of play. I like to play aggressive in this spot. Maybe that's a leak for me.

Turn is fine. Interesting that he just called and then hammered on the 3 on the river. At this level, I don't know how common slow playing is. Maybe he had 33xx or 83xx?? I don't know. But I don't see a lot of hands that he has that you beat. Being that it's rush, does the average villain at this level make a large river bet that will only be called by something that beats him?

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Old Aug 04, 2010, 3:44am   #3
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FWIW the river bet means he's either turning 8xxx into a bluff, has a full house, has some sort of air-like hand or has the 2nd nut flush (maybe)

Range weighted heavily towards full houses and bluffs though.
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Old Aug 04, 2010, 4:53am   #4
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Joey, what do you do here?

Also, anyone else is welcome to take a crack at it
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Old Aug 04, 2010, 12:53pm   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SwoopAE View Post
Joey, what do you do here?

Also, anyone else is welcome to take a crack at it
Flop raise would be bad, raising "to see where you are at" is almost always horrible in any form of poker.

River is a pretty easy fold. Sure his line is non sensical but he obviously has something after he leads the flop and ck calls the turn. Its pretty unlikely at this level he is turning a 8 into a bluff. So that leaves somesort of nut hand that he butchered and is scared that you will ck behind, maybe he just realized he has a straight flush.

I would need to know that villian had lost complete control of bodily functions before calling here.
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Old Aug 05, 2010, 12:43am   #6
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Originally Posted by joeyjoejoejr View Post
Flop raise would be bad, raising "to see where you are at" is almost always horrible in any form of poker.

River is a pretty easy fold. Sure his line is non sensical but he obviously has something after he leads the flop and ck calls the turn. Its pretty unlikely at this level he is turning a 8 into a bluff. So that leaves somesort of nut hand that he butchered and is scared that you will ck behind, maybe he just realized he has a straight flush.

I would need to know that villian had lost complete control of bodily functions before calling here.
Yeah cool I was thinking that for a moment, originally and then after I timed out I liked the fold though for reasons pretty much matching what you described here.
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Old Aug 06, 2010, 6:21pm   #7
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I think the turn bet is pretty bad. I'd like to hear your thinking there.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 2:45am   #8
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I think the turn bet is pretty bad. I'd like to hear your thinking there.
I think betting the turn is good.
Its pretty easy for either of them to have a worse flush or a bad 8 and call.

The flop bet was pretty small so Laurent is going to have some speculative flush draws that can call. And the bet size could indicate a weak draw that is now deciding to ck call after making a flush.

WinterKing line this hand is defintely indicative of a very weak player and in general I would be inclined to make all sorts of value bets against him.

A guy that thinks lead small, ck call, bet pot on a brick is a good line is also going to make lots of horrible plays like lead small with a 7 high flush then ck call twice after making it on a paired board.
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Old Aug 07, 2010, 6:37am   #9
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Originally Posted by jimmytrick View Post
I think the turn bet is pretty bad. I'd like to hear your thinking there.
Value/protection against 8x, value against lower flushes. Obviously i'm getting flatted and checked to by a lot of weaker hands, it's too thin to value bet the river as well, but i'm just guessing if I check the turn and get led into on the river and it feels gross to just give up the turn. I'm not expecting to get flatted on the turn much and led into on the river (as happened here) and thats the only really bad thing that can happen (if I get raised on the turn I can just fold)
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