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Old Mar 02, 2006, 1:35am   #1
tennisjump
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Default Omaha Hi/Lo hand

PokerStars Game #4144009030: Tournament #20513650, Omaha Hi/Lo Limit - Level I (20/40) - 2006/03/01 - 21:28:14 (ET)
Table '20513650 225' Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: vatzy2190 (1500 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 2: lightbright (1380 in chips)
Seat 3: dwright (1380 in chips)
Seat 4: buhnstar (1500 in chips)
Seat 6: Roller921 (1640 in chips)
Seat 7: gargs13 (1460 in chips)
Seat 8: claw192 (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: theklownz1 (1640 in chips)
dwright: posts small blind 10
buhnstar: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to claw192 [7d 2h 2c 3s]
Roller921: calls 20
gargs13: calls 20
claw192: calls 20
theklownz1: calls 20
vatzy2190: folds
lightbright: calls 20
lightbright said, "how do you play this game"
dwright: calls 10
buhnstar: checks


Yeah I know its a questionable limp, the table was passive, okay.

*** FLOP *** [2d Kd Ks]
claw192 said, "you fold"
claw192 said, "every hand"
claw192 said, "lol"
dwright: bets 20
buhnstar said, "hahaha"
buhnstar: folds
theklownz1 said, "lol"
chadp13 is connected
Roller921: calls 20
gargs13: folds
claw192: raises 20 to 40
theklownz1: calls 40
buhnstar said, "best five card hand wins and lowest five card hand wins"
claw192 said, "you use two cards from your hand"
lightbright said, "ok"
lightbright: raises 20 to 60
dwright: raises 20 to 80
Betting is capped
buhnstar said, "u not supposed to say that lol"
Roller921: folds
lightbright said, "thanx"
claw192: calls 40
claw192 said, "lol"
claw192 said, "why not?"
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: calls 20


Flop comes giving me the third nuts, I'm figuring pocket kings would've raised, just hoping no K 2 is out there, pay attention to the chat im having



*** TURN *** [2d Kd Ks] [9c]
dwright said, "u have to use 2 cards from your hand"
dwright: checks
claw192: bets 40
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: raises 40 to 80
dwright: calls 80
claw192: calls 40
theklownz1 said, "yes"
buhnstar said, "this dude was capping it with me when he had a 2 of spades for low straight flush"
theklownz1: calls 40


Low is out, good for me, I still think I have the best hand here


*** RIVER *** [2d Kd Ks 9c] [5h]
claw192 said, "oh"
claw192 said, "lol"
dwright: checks
claw192: bets 40
buhnstar said, "had like 1 pair lol"
vatzy2190 has returned
claw192 said, "haha"
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: raises 40 to 80
dwright: folds
claw192: raises 40 to 120
theklownz1: calls 80
lightbright: raises 40 to 160
Betting is capped
claw192: calls 40
buhnstar said, "a 3"
theklownz1: calls 40

So what do you think about my play here?
Anything you would advise?
Thanks

I'll tell the results after some discussion
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Old Mar 02, 2006, 2:06am   #2
StampyDodo
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Default Re: Omaha Hi/Lo hand

Quote:
Originally Posted by tennisjump
PokerStars Game #4144009030: Tournament #20513650, Omaha Hi/Lo Limit - Level I (20/40) - 2006/03/01 - 21:28:14 (ET)
Table '20513650 225' Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: vatzy2190 (1500 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 2: lightbright (1380 in chips)
Seat 3: dwright (1380 in chips)
Seat 4: buhnstar (1500 in chips)
Seat 6: Roller921 (1640 in chips)
Seat 7: gargs13 (1460 in chips)
Seat 8: claw192 (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: theklownz1 (1640 in chips)
dwright: posts small blind 10
buhnstar: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to claw192 [7d 2h 2c 3s]
Roller921: calls 20
gargs13: calls 20
claw192: calls 20
theklownz1: calls 20
vatzy2190: folds
lightbright: calls 20
lightbright said, "how do you play this game"
dwright: calls 10
buhnstar: checks


Yeah I know its a questionable limp, the table was passive, okay.

*** FLOP *** [2d Kd Ks]
claw192 said, "you fold"
claw192 said, "every hand"
claw192 said, "lol"
dwright: bets 20
buhnstar said, "hahaha"
buhnstar: folds
theklownz1 said, "lol"
chadp13 is connected
Roller921: calls 20
gargs13: folds
claw192: raises 20 to 40
theklownz1: calls 40
buhnstar said, "best five card hand wins and lowest five card hand wins"
claw192 said, "you use two cards from your hand"
lightbright said, "ok"
lightbright: raises 20 to 60
dwright: raises 20 to 80
Betting is capped
buhnstar said, "u not supposed to say that lol"
Roller921: folds
lightbright said, "thanx"
claw192: calls 40
claw192 said, "lol"
claw192 said, "why not?"
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: calls 20


Flop comes giving me the third nuts, I'm figuring pocket kings would've raised, just hoping no K 2 is out there, pay attention to the chat im having



*** TURN *** [2d Kd Ks] [9c]
dwright said, "u have to use 2 cards from your hand"
dwright: checks
claw192: bets 40
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: raises 40 to 80
dwright: calls 80
claw192: calls 40
theklownz1 said, "yes"
buhnstar said, "this dude was capping it with me when he had a 2 of spades for low straight flush"
theklownz1: calls 40


Low is out, good for me, I still think I have the best hand here


*** RIVER *** [2d Kd Ks 9c] [5h]
claw192 said, "oh"
claw192 said, "lol"
dwright: checks
claw192: bets 40
buhnstar said, "had like 1 pair lol"
vatzy2190 has returned
claw192 said, "haha"
theklownz1: calls 40
lightbright: raises 40 to 80
dwright: folds
claw192: raises 40 to 120
theklownz1: calls 80
lightbright: raises 40 to 160
Betting is capped
claw192: calls 40
buhnstar said, "a 3"
theklownz1: calls 40

So what do you think about my play here?
Anything you would advise?
Thanks

I'll tell the results after some discussion
No. First off your hand isn't quite good enough to justify a limp. Though its pretty close.

Why would you think Pocket Kings would have raised? This is Ohama High Low.

Your river play was bad. You have the worst boat possible. There's no way dueces full of kings holds up with this action on this board.

You hand in general has a huge probelm. There's way too many ways for you to be beat. Either your ahead in the hand but there's a motherload of outs to beat you or your drawing to one out.

You probably shouldn’t have limped, but there's no way you should have went past the flop.
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Old Mar 03, 2006, 4:18am   #3
tennisjump
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Thanks for your advice, starting hands are still a little fuzzy to me, It's hard getting used to having a full house and saying it really isn't that great.
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Old Mar 03, 2006, 7:27am   #4
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No offense intended, but that was terrible. First of, your hand is utter crap, not worth one measly chip, especially not in a tournament.

You flop an underfull, and except for that last 2 you are going nowhere. There is a bet and a raise in front of you, so at least one of them likes the 2 Kings and is just waiting to make a boat, if he doesn't have K2, that is.

If you are stubborn, you might want to go into check/call and pray your underfull is good, but raising here is...plain stupid. The only hands that call have you beat. If the other players have any clue what they are doing, that is.
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Old Mar 03, 2006, 3:12pm   #5
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I just pissed away 60 bucks at a Ohama table THINKING it was an Ohama High/Low Table.. I was shocked when i didn't get half the pot...
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Old Mar 03, 2006, 9:34pm   #6
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Like other said, you shouldn't be limping with 2237 rainbow. About the only place I'd voluntarily put money in the pot with this hand is if I was in the small blind. And also, if you're raising all your KKxx hands and expect others to do that as well, then you need to read something about O8 starting hand selection.

As for the flop, this is actually a good flop for your hand - underboat with a flush draw out there that someone might chase and a backdoor low someone might chase. The problem here is that one person with a Kxxx with completely live outs has about a 40% chance to outdraw you. If there's more than one person with Kxxx and they aren't sharing many outs, you're actually an underdog to win the pot! And like you mentioned, there's even a chance you're drawing dead!

So basically, after you see the flop get capped with four people in there, I go into check-call mode for the rest of the hand. You have no way of knowing if the turn or river card gives your Kxxx opponent(s) the boat, so it is hard to raise for value. However, I wouldn't want to give up on this large a pot since it is not a certainty you're beat. Also, the guy doing the reraising is the guy asking how to play the game, which argues for you not giving up on the hand (unless you think he's acting), but I'd bet at least the guy in there just calling along has Kxxx.
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Old Mar 05, 2006, 11:43pm   #7
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Thanks for your comments, I'm curious about some borderline omaha hi/lo hands then. I'm going to assume that limping in with that 2/3 isn't a good play, will you always limp in with A2xx unsuited, how about A3xx or AAxx, are all of those limpable hands?
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Old Mar 06, 2006, 1:07pm   #8
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Cappiletti's book
Baldwin's chapter in SSII
Zee's book

All three of these are good resources for learning to play O8.
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Old Mar 06, 2006, 6:57pm   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tennisjump
Thanks for your comments, I'm curious about some borderline omaha hi/lo hands then. I'm going to assume that limping in with that 2/3 isn't a good play, will you always limp in with A2xx unsuited, how about A3xx or AAxx, are all of those limpable hands?
Assuming this is a 10 handed low limit game,

AAxx is NOT a good hand. With AAxx you want AA2x or AA3x. Or you want 2 other cards 10 or over with your pair of aces.

Also A3 isn't really good enough to limp byitself. You want A3KQ, or A345, You should be folding hands like A389.

A2xx by itself is ususaly good enough to limp, and maybe even cold call one raise. But don't cold call 2 raises. This is because your you have to figure one of the raisers probably has A-2-3 or something, and thus you'll be drawing to 1/4th of the pot. (among other reasons)
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Old Mar 06, 2006, 11:16pm   #10
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Hey there. It's been a long long long time since I posted on here, but I've been checking out the vids and just had to reply to this.

You guys play too tight for this game. If all you ever play is A2 and AA/A3 with decent leftover cards, you might make a little money, but you're not gonna make the real money, and you're certainly not gonna get really far in mtts.

Of course, as a disclaimer, everything is relative. There's no way to peg down exactly what you should or should not do. There's just some general guidelines to help you make your decision. Secondly, I'm assuming through all of this that your are playing limit, this does not apply to pot limit. Thirdly, I'm assuming that this is not a high-stakes game. In a high-stakes game, there isn't enough dead money to justify the following.

A3XX is almost always good enough to limp. I'll even limp with A4XX/A5XX if there's some good leftovers. A389 is a fine hand, especially if the ace is suited. Let's remind ourselves that we're playing to scoop the pot. This is the key. There's a lot of situations where A389 single/double suited will scoop. We also need to realize that playing lower omaha 8, there is genearlly 50% plyrs/flop or better. There is so much dead money in there, and players will call down with such shit that you are more than justified in mixing up your starting hand selection.

Bad to mediocre omaha 8 players have one of two problems, either they draw to the high or play for the low.

You have to get in there and mix it up with some less than stellar starting hands. Those who religiously play A2 etc are so incredibly predictable. While playing this ultra-tight game will win you money, you're not taking full advantage of the dead money in the pot. You will win bigger pots, more often with the mediocre hands then with the stellar starting hands.

This game is incredibly flop dependant/situational. You need to see more flops, period. But here's another key, you have to have post-flop discipline. You can be loose before the flop, but you're doing so to hit the flop and get all the dead money. If you continue after the flop with only draws or 2nd/3rd/4th nut lows, you become the dead money.
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