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Old Dec 13, 2006, 3:05am   #1
SilentKiller86
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Default Switching gears

Ok so I'm normally a tight aggressive player (i guess that's my label).... I have a question about when it's time to switch gears around the midway point in the tourney:

Situation:

I'm the button
Hole cards: J10s
Mid-Position raises 3x BB
Heads up to flop (my opponent is a "maniac")
Flop comes 10h Qs 9s (i have mid pair and flush draw)
Maniac bets 3/4 pot


Do i raise to slow him down or just call?... (i hate maniacs) lol

any advice would be nice
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 3:18am   #2
Gus
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You could be a nit, it doesnt matter here. In fact, your example is not really good if you want to speak about switching gears.
What you just flopped is called the nuts. You're raising 100% for value here, and you WANT him to call. Do I understand it right ? you flopped an OESFD + a pair ? You dont want him to slow down, you want to be all in on the flop if possible.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 3:48am   #3
SilentKiller86
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lol... whoops....i didnt mean to give myself that many outs but anyways, lets just say... i flop mid pair and flush draw... he/she bets into me... raise or call?

haha wow i didnt even realize what i typed in my first message....lol open ended str8 flush draw and mid pair... ya of course i would want him to push.... i seem like an idiot now... haha

Last edited by SilentKiller86; Dec 13, 2006 at 3:52am.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 4:09am   #4
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Whenever I get a combo draw on the flop, I bet or raise and hope he raises back so I can push.

It kind of depends. With maniacs in the sense that they triple barrel jack high cackling with glee, I make thinner calls and don't bet or raise for value until the river. With LAGgy types, (who can also triple barrel jack high cackling with glee, but don't make a habit out of it) I prefer to move on the turn or river.

oh edit: this is apparently a tournament. Um, I dunno. I sort of have this thing where I hate playing with less than 100 BBs in my stack, so yeah.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 5:24am   #5
Petroz
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Changing gears is more of a thing where you have an image and you use that image to your advantage. In most situations playing solid will get you through to the final tables and then you need to be more concious of your image. Trying to mix up your game early in a tourney will often be ineffective with a weak field. Most players don't pay much attention to the other player's images.

Example:
Lets say you've been playing extremely tight and the players have noticed this and are folding to your raises.
You can bluff some of the big pots with that kind of image as well as steal more blinds. So now your playing loose with a tight image and have 'changed gears'.

The reverse is true if you play loose players will often remember that even if you tighten up for a few orbits. This would allow you to get paid off with a big hand. This is more effective at a full table because players notice the guy whos trying to steal more than his fair share of pots. Tight players often go unnoticed and thats what makes tag an effective play style.

It's the sort of thing to be used at your discression. It's not easy to say objectively that a player should or shouldn't of changed gears at a certain point with only one hand to go by. It's all the previous hands and the quality of the competition that determines whether or not it's a good idea. Alot of times it's futile and loosening up will most likely result in dumping your chips to an ABC tag player if you cannot play well postflop.

"lets just say... i flop mid pair and flush draw"
The example hand you posted is more an example where your image might be useful, but against a maniac i sincerely doubt he cares. If you think the player will jam if you hit the draw then i might call; If he is capable of any kind of lay down then i would raise. But it all depends on the board and his range. If the flop had an ace i might not raise since Ax is probably in his range and he'll most likely come over the top.

(I don't play tourneys these are just my thoughts on the topic)

-Petroz
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 5:41am   #6
Ishbu3116
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Changing gears would be if you played super aggresssively then tightened up to get value on a big hand later on. It is also used to confuse your opponents. As it goes for the hands with the pair and flush draw, this is almost always a raise for me. Unless I know that by keeping him aroudn that I can easily bust him.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 6:44am   #7
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Yeah, FWIW I occasionally get chatter about raising it up, but I see those people stack off TPMK to the 10/3 multitabler who was representing aces the entire way. I don't tighten up unless someone is actively gunning for me, in which case I move over to TAG.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 10:38pm   #8
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I dont think that changing gears is that big of deal in online tourneys. Correct me if im wrong. But for example, in a MMTT (even mtt sng) there are many things that make me think changing gears does nothing.

1. You change tables often.
If you are at a new table and switch gears... no one will know but you.

2. People dont pay to much attention online.
Online play lets you multi table and multi task poker altogether. If you play 1/50 hands then raise ... the guy who is playing 4 tourneys, listing to Kanye West on full blast, and talking to his girlfriend on AIM isnt going to say "Oh this guys is tight, I should fold"

3. Stakes.
If you are playing a $5 tourney people are not going to be that good. If you are playing tight and decide to change gears... the people you are playing against have to be good enough to notice your tight play in the first place. They also have to be good enough to know how to adapt. IE: in a $100 sng everyone knows your tight, you raise 4x, most people will fold. In a $1 sng, everyone knows your tight, you raise 4x... "eh who cares... its a buck.. lets gamble"

Of course you need to "change gears" from a 10 person table to a HU game... and other obvious reasons... but for the most part im going to say its really not that important at the stakes most people are playing (no offence to poster).

I dono... my 2c. What yall think

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Old Dec 13, 2006, 11:41pm   #9
SilentKiller86
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ryan,

lol... i dont even play online anyways... i only play live... so yes it is important to change gears... i was looking for a response geared towards what frog had to say...

dont make assumptions about what i play and try to sound like a smartass:

"Of course you need to "change gears" from a 10 person table to a HU game... and other obvious reasons... but for the most part im going to say its really not that important at the stakes most people are playing (no offence to poster)."

thx for the effort tho...lol
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Old Dec 14, 2006, 2:46am   #10
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Silent,

First of all from my experience at this site, a vast majority of the players here do in fact play poker online. So much so that when someone is posting a thread about a "live game" they usually state so at the beginning of the post. For future reference - you might want to do the same.

Second, in rebuttal to your post about my … post, this site is not the place to make remarks like “dont make assumptions about what i play and try to sound like a smartass.” Pokertips.org is a place where poker players of all skill levels can come together to discuss everything from poker events to specific Hand Histories. It is not the place to vent your anger and/or make rude comments towards fellow pokertip.org members. Try to keep that in mind the next time you make a post.
(Also, I did say “no offence to poster”)

Now, about your post in general:
1.When posting a hand it would be helpful if you included the following --
- Buy-in of tournament
- Table size (number of players at the table)
- Stack sizes of the players involved in the hand
- Current blind level
- Payout structure (when close to or in the money)

These are all very important factors when discussing a specific NLHE hand. The more information you include in your post, the better (and more specific) the advice you receive will be.

2. Your post was about “switching gears.”

I think we can all agree that switching gears is when you change/alter your current style of play. This could be for many reasons – anywhere from keeping your play unpredictable to adapting to a new player at your table.(Just a generalization guys =P) Now back to your post.

“Ok so I'm normally a tight aggressive player (i guess that's my label).... I have a question about when it's time to switch gears around the midway point in the tourney:
Situation:
I'm the button
Hole cards: J10s
Mid-Position raises 3x BB
Heads up to flop (my opponent is a "maniac")
Flop comes 10h Qs 9s (i have mid pair and flush draw)
Maniac bets 3/4 pot
Do i raise to slow him down or just call?... (i hate maniacs) lol

any advice would be nice

  • “I have a question about when it's time to switch gears around the midway point in the tourney” This leaves little room for input in my opinion. At what time (around the midway point of a tournament) is it correct to switch gears? I don’t even agree with this question but I guess I’ll work with it.
  • Because of the lack of information here I will assume a few things: By “tight aggressive” you mean you have been playing very few hands, but raising hard when you do. That assumption leads me to the next assumption I am forced to make: Normally you would fold JsTs on the button to a 3x raise from mid-position.
  • Your statement “i have mid pair and flush draw” is actually incorrect. Ts Js on a Th Qs 9s flop is middle pair + an open ended strait flush draw. This makes your hand a 2:1 favorite against an overpair (such as AA), a slight favorite against two pair, and a very slight underdog to a set.
  • “Do I raise to slow him down or just call? … (I hate maniacs)” I have no idea what you mean by raising to “slow him down.” A blocking bet (blocking raise I guess) to keep him from betting the turn so you can see the river for free? And what qualifies the villain to be a maniac here is beyond me… A 3x PF raise followed by a continuation bet is pretty standard in my book.
  • So you are asking if you should raise or call. I am guessing because you are tight aggressive you would normally raise here? And you’re asking if you should change gears and call here instead? I am totally confused.

3. “i was looking for a response geared towards what frog had to say...”
FrogBoy4L said what he prefers to do when he flops a combo draw. If you wanted to know what other people do when they flop combo draws I think you would be better off making a post about that, not changing gears.

4. That all out of the way:
You already know what I think about changing gears. That aside in general I think that if you have a reason to change gears you should. If there is no reason to change the style of your play… you probably shouldn’t. About what you should do on the flop – (keep in mind I have no idea what the stack sizes, blinds, and payouts are) I would probably re-raise the most you think the villain will call. I would guess about 80% of the time you have the best hand here and should try to get the most money in the pot you possibly can.



Hope that helps you out.
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