THE FORUMS


German ForumsGeneral DiscussionStrategyFrench Forum

Go Back   PokerTips.org Forums > Strategy > Omaha Ring Games

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Apr 06, 2008, 1:39am   #1
SidMaynard
Too tired for poker
 
SidMaynard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Brighton, UK
Posts: 1,303
Reputation: 0
SidMaynard
Default Omaha High - Playing Aces on a paired flop

Ok, so I'm having some difficulty learning how to play Aces in Omaha and I tend to overplay them due to my HoldEm background.

How would you play the following two hands where you raise pf and then face a seemingly safe paired flop:

***** Hand 1027904354 *****
0.05/0.10 Omaha (PL) - Sunday, April 06, 2008 1:18:08 AM
Table OH 50 (Real /Cash Game )
Seat 1: KitLatura (7.74)
Seat 2: tepychuj (14.32)
Seat 3: Grotrian (10.00)
Seat 4: SidMynrd (12.32)
Seat 5: Burneo (8.21)
KitLatura post SB 0.05
SidMynrd post BB 0.10
** Deal **
SidMynrd [Ac, Ad, 4d, 4c]
*** Bet Round 1 ***
Burneo Call 0.10
KitLatura Call 0.10
SidMynrd Raise to 0.40
Burneo Fold
KitLatura Call 0.40
*** Flop(Board): *** : [10c, 2s, 2d]
*** Bet Round 2 ***
KitLatura Check
SidMynrd ?????

And this one:

***** Hand 1027863559 *****
0.05/0.10 Omaha (PL) - Sunday, April 06, 2008 12:37:31 AM
Table OH 50 (Real /Cash Game )
Seat 1: KitLatura (6.14)
Seat 2: tepychuj (6.90)
Seat 3: hugosad (9.12)
Seat 4: SidMynrd (22.47)
Seat 5: Burneo (8.54)
hugosad post SB 0.05
SidMynrd post BB 0.10
** Deal **
SidMynrd [8d, 4h, Ad, Ah]
*** Bet Round 1 ***
Burneo Fold
KitLatura Call 0.10
tepychuj Call 0.10
hugosad Raise to 0.50
SidMynrd Raise to 1.70
KitLatura Fold
tepychuj Fold
hugosad Call 1.70
*** Flop(Board): *** : [9d, 9s, 10d]
*** Bet Round 2 ***
hugosad Check
SidMynrd ?????
__________________
PortaGadgetsUK - for the latest in digital technology
SidMaynard est déconnecté   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Don't like this ad? Register to make it go away!

Old Apr 06, 2008, 2:47am   #2
TWLLM
100
 
TWLLM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,271
Reputation: 957
TWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to behold
Default

I bet pot on both flops. Especially because you're in position.

The first hand, the pair is very low, it's heads up, and so it's less likely (but not impossible, of course) that he has trips. You're biggest worry is ttxx, but even that's not enough to stop you from betting. This is arguably one of the best non-ace flops you could have asked for, and you can't raise AAxx preflop unless you're willing to fire this flop.


The second hand is a little trickery, in that the board is less dry, but the key is you're HU, and you have the nut flush draw.

Expect more action on this one, but fire anyway. Unless he has exactly TTxx, you have more than your two remain aces as outs. If raised you probably have to put it in unless he's deeper or a known passive player.
__________________
If I were Vietnamese my name would be Kno Nguyen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleU
Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?

Last edited by TWLLM; Apr 06, 2008 at 2:52am.
TWLLM est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 3:03am   #3
rcb17
Grinder
 
rcb17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 561
Reputation: 17
rcb17 is on a distinguished road
Send a message via AIM to rcb17 Send a message via Skype™ to rcb17
Default

Second TWLLM's suggestions. Load tubes one and two, and fire away. More often than not you're in the big lead, and more often than not will have draws to save you on the second one.

Of course you are playing microstakes, which means they could be playing with exactly anything, and folding is kind of a disease at that level. Expect serious suckouts from people that have no concept of pot odds and proper preflop play.
__________________
____________________________________
Appalachian State Mountaineers - 2005, 2006, and 2007 I-AA National Champions!

Michigan WHO? 34-32!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rBzoXqCEnA
rcb17 est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 3:22am   #4
TWLLM
100
 
TWLLM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,271
Reputation: 957
TWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to behold
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcb17 View Post
Of course you are playing OMAHA, which means they could be playing with exactly anything
FYP.
__________________
If I were Vietnamese my name would be Kno Nguyen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleU
Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?
TWLLM est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 7:42am   #5
Emain2
Doyle Look-alike
 
Emain2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Nottingham
Posts: 289
Reputation: 9
Emain2 is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcb17 View Post

Of course you are OMAHA, which means they ARE playing with exactly anything.
FYP+1

Also make sure that you are not only raising with aces. If I was playing against you and had noticed that was the case I would call you preflop with quite a range of cards (low wraps are always fun for this) because I would know pretty much where you were and you would have no idea of my hand, add in you will be OOP...you know how it goes.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwoopAE View Post
You've played too much limit already. You're beyond salvation. We can't save everyone.
Emain2 est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 11:53am   #6
SidMaynard
Too tired for poker
 
SidMaynard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Brighton, UK
Posts: 1,303
Reputation: 0
SidMaynard
Default

Well bet is pretty much what I did do. I should have posted the hands the other way round as I played Hand 2 first and Hand 1 later in the session, and Hand 2 affected how I played Hand 1.

Hand 2: I bet pot and villain raised me all-in. There are so many draws on this board I don't see how I can get away from it with the nut flush draw. He turned over KcKsQh9h and his trip 9s held up.

Hand 1: I bet pot and villain raised pot. I folded. Now this is the hand I am most interested in as it is such a dry board. It's one of those hands where you think he can't have a 2 and then stack off to some donkey with four raggedy cards.

Is bet/fold the right line here? My bluff catching inner donkey wanted to call, but I was still smarting from Hand 2 so I folded.
__________________
PortaGadgetsUK - for the latest in digital technology
SidMaynard est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 6:32pm   #7
BubbleBoy
BubbleBoy
 
BubbleBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: BubbleBoy
Posts: 11,484
Reputation: 28914
BubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond reputeBubbleBoy has a reputation beyond repute
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

assuming OOP, what would you do?

this scenario hast cost me a lot of $$ the past couple days. (not AAxx exactly, just a medium made hand OOP heads up on the flop)

position kills in omaha.
__________________

BubbleBoy est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 6:58pm   #8
TWLLM
100
 
TWLLM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,271
Reputation: 957
TWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to behold
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SidMaynard View Post
Well bet is pretty much what I did do. I should have posted the hands the other way round as I played Hand 2 first and Hand 1 later in the session, and Hand 2 affected how I played Hand 1.

Hand 2: I bet pot and villain raised me all-in. There are so many draws on this board I don't see how I can get away from it with the nut flush draw. He turned over KcKsQh9h and his trip 9s held up.

Hand 1: I bet pot and villain raised pot. I folded. Now this is the hand I am most interested in as it is such a dry board. It's one of those hands where you think he can't have a 2 and then stack off to some donkey with four raggedy cards.

Is bet/fold the right line here? My bluff catching inner donkey wanted to call, but I was still smarting from Hand 2 so I folded.
I definitely think you can get away from the first hand (T22) because even after a PSB you're far from committed. Without a read, you may just have to give it up - this isn't exactly a bluffer's board. Again, I'm applying principles from higher-stakes games though, so I have no clue at these levels how people play. So bet/fold is fine.


On the second hand, the key is there are a lot of bluffs, and you've built a big pot so I think you're heavily committed. He'll show up with a random 9 here now and then and you'll be behind, but if you don't PSB, it's terrible, and if you do, you're pretty well committed. Again, if you didn't have the flush draw, it would be time to give up on that flop and hope he doesn't steal it.

The solution for hand #2 might be to 3-bet him smaller, and take a HU flop in position w/o being committed to the hand. Of course, you want to do this with more than aaxx though, otherwise you make it too easy to read your hand. Just make sure you pay attention to stack and pot sizes at all times in PLO - it's far, far more important than in other PL games.
__________________
If I were Vietnamese my name would be Kno Nguyen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleU
Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?
TWLLM est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 7:03pm   #9
TWLLM
100
 
TWLLM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,271
Reputation: 957
TWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to beholdTWLLM is a splendid one to behold
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BubbleBoy View Post
assuming OOP, what would you do?

this scenario hast cost me a lot of $$ the past couple days. (not AAxx exactly, just a medium made hand OOP heads up on the flop)

position kills in omaha.
OOP the hands would be completely different, right? Because either you're facing someone cold-calling a 3bet (which is almost always either a total donk with kkxx, or more likely, someone with a super drawy hand like 89tj ds) or you're what, being 3-bet and not 4-betting?

AAxx oop is NOT something you want to be 3-betting much, unless you're short or you can get it in because the other player is retarded LAG preflop.

You're right that position kills in omaha.

If I were you, I'd post hands you're having problems with rather than asking a broad question about playing aaxx oop, the reason being that omaha is NOT a game of hard and fast rules or platitudes, it really requires a consideration of so many factors there's essentially no 'rules' to this game. Hell, when I play, the laws of math don't even apply.
__________________
If I were Vietnamese my name would be Kno Nguyen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleU
Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?
TWLLM est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Apr 06, 2008, 9:52pm   #10
SidMaynard
Too tired for poker
 
SidMaynard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Brighton, UK
Posts: 1,303
Reputation: 0
SidMaynard
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TWLLM View Post
The solution for hand #2 might be to 3-bet him smaller, and take a HU flop in position w/o being committed to the hand.
This is good advice. I definately think that Aces are difficult to play when you signpost them (ie 3bet) but don't get enough of your stack in to the middle pf. Is there an optimum stack to pot ratio you should be looking for with AAxx?

If I had 3bet smaller, would I be looking to bet/fold, or is there a different line to take with the nut flush draw?
__________________
PortaGadgetsUK - for the latest in digital technology
SidMaynard est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 12:37am. vBulletin 3.7.4 Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.