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Old Mar 10, 2009, 6:11am   #1
joeyjoejoejr
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Default I need help

I have become a nit!!

Hands like these disgust me:

Seat 1: bobbyd1515 ($60.10 in chips)
Seat 2: darrenjp ($425.45 in chips)
Seat 3: crancowboy1 ($72.60 in chips)
Seat 4: Chiren80 ($234.15 in chips)
Seat 5: BeatPurdue ($225.80 in chips)
Seat 6: micula213 ($200 in chips)
Seat 7: Mr.smith12 ($200 in chips)
Seat 8: jth74 ($214.50 in chips)
Seat 9: joeyjoejr ($330.05 in chips)
micula213: posts small blind $1
Mr.smith12: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Qs Qd]
jth74: folds
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
bobbyd1515: folds
darrenjp: folds
crancowboy1: calls $4
Chiren80: folds
BeatPurdue: raises $18 to $22
micula213: folds
Mr.smith12: folds
joeyjoejr: folds

Seat 1: XxStacks60xX ($200 in chips)
Seat 3: BlGGIESMALLS ($207.65 in chips)
Seat 4: Antipant ($45.95 in chips)
Seat 5: Beatlejuice ($43.80 in chips)
Seat 6: joeyjoejr ($249.15 in chips)
Seat 8: Prairie Hawk ($211 in chips)
Seat 9: *ALE* ($221.75 in chips)
BlGGIESMALLS: posts small blind $1
Antipant: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Kh Kc]
Beatlejuice: folds
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
Prairie Hawk: folds
*ALE*: folds
XxStacks60xX: calls $4
taikucing joins the table at seat #7
BlGGIESMALLS: folds
Antipant: folds
*** FLOP *** [3d Jd Th]
joeyjoejr: bets $10
XxStacks60xX: raises $22 to $32
joeyjoejr: folds

Table 'Tekmessa II' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: AcutePoker ($52.30 in chips)
Seat 4: bkgotgame ($307.75 in chips)
Seat 5: aref1981 ($40 in chips)
Seat 6: MightyScrot ($391.40 in chips)
Seat 7: BBKING344 ($185.80 in chips)
Seat 8: Chiren80 ($226 in chips)
Seat 9: joeyjoejr ($333 in chips)
BBKING344: posts small blind $1
Chiren80: posts big blind $2
Johnny Osaka: sits out
narrator123: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Ah Ac]
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
AcutePoker: folds
bkgotgame: folds
aref1981: folds
MightyScrot: folds
BBKING344: calls $3
Chiren80: calls $2
*** FLOP *** [8h 6h 2s]
BBKING344: checks
Chiren80: checks
joeyjoejr: bets $8
BBKING344: raises $18 to $26
Chiren80: folds
joeyjoejr: folds

Table 'Verbiest IV' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: sebaaastian ($293.10 in chips)
Seat 2: micula213 ($200 in chips)
Seat 3: VACBlack ($37 in chips)
Seat 4: JLHARLEY43 ($142.95 in chips)
Seat 5: TheLife ($239.40 in chips)
Seat 6: joeyjoejr ($138 in chips)
Seat 7: Hilikus_mike ($335.55 in chips)
Seat 8: cfost28 ($95.65 in chips)
JLHARLEY43: posts small blind $1
TheLife: posts big blind $2
dropkickz: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [7c 7h]
joeyjoejr: raises $4 to $6
Hilikus_mike: folds
cfost28: folds
sebaaastian: folds
micula213: calls $6
VACBlack: folds
JLHARLEY43: folds
TheLife: calls $4
*** FLOP *** [Jd 7s 9d]
TheLife: checks
joeyjoejr: bets $14
micula213: raises $24 to $38
TheLife: folds
joeyjoejr: folds!

Table 'Polaris VI' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: VACBlack ($46 in chips)
Seat 2: gutter23 ($233.50 in chips)
Seat 3: pokerpoopy ($226.55 in chips)
Seat 4: 4timmy ($369.65 in chips)
Seat 6: cihmi ($333.20 in chips)
Seat 7: joeyjoejr ($200 in chips)
Seat 8: MightyScrot ($201 in chips)
Seat 9: *ALE* ($261.80 in chips)
MightyScrot: posts small blind $1
*ALE*: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [3h 3s]
VACBlack: folds
gutter23: folds
pokerpoopy: folds
4timmy: raises $4 to $6
cihmi: folds
joeyjoejr: calls $6
gutter23 is sitting out
MightyScrot: folds
*ALE*: folds
*** FLOP *** [2d 2s 8c]
4timmy: checks
joeyjoejr: checks
*** TURN *** [2d 2s 8c] [3d]
4timmy: bets $10
joeyjoejr: raises $24 to $34
4timmy: raises $34 to $68
joeyjoejr: folds!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 6:59am   #2
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wat da phuck
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 7:16am   #3
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This obviously shows just how much I don't know about ring games...
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<Kc>this one is much closer to good advice but still introduces some unnecessary shortcuts across the grass for us to cover our boots in dog shit.
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 7:22am   #4
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u want to explain the min raises??

other than that i looked at them they are believeable
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 7:43am   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyjoejoejr View Post
I have become a nit!!

Hands like these disgust me:

Seat 1: bobbyd1515 ($60.10 in chips)
Seat 2: darrenjp ($425.45 in chips)
Seat 3: crancowboy1 ($72.60 in chips)
Seat 4: Chiren80 ($234.15 in chips)
Seat 5: BeatPurdue ($225.80 in chips)
Seat 6: micula213 ($200 in chips)
Seat 7: Mr.smith12 ($200 in chips)
Seat 8: jth74 ($214.50 in chips)
Seat 9: joeyjoejr ($330.05 in chips)
micula213: posts small blind $1
Mr.smith12: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Qs Qd]
jth74: folds
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
bobbyd1515: folds
darrenjp: folds
crancowboy1: calls $4
Chiren80: folds
BeatPurdue: raises $18 to $22
micula213: folds
Mr.smith12: folds
joeyjoejr: folds

Meh but not terrible.

Seat 1: XxStacks60xX ($200 in chips)
Seat 3: BlGGIESMALLS ($207.65 in chips)
Seat 4: Antipant ($45.95 in chips)
Seat 5: Beatlejuice ($43.80 in chips)
Seat 6: joeyjoejr ($249.15 in chips)
Seat 8: Prairie Hawk ($211 in chips)
Seat 9: *ALE* ($221.75 in chips)
BlGGIESMALLS: posts small blind $1
Antipant: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Kh Kc]
Beatlejuice: folds
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
Prairie Hawk: folds
*ALE*: folds
XxStacks60xX: calls $4
taikucing joins the table at seat #7
BlGGIESMALLS: folds
Antipant: folds
*** FLOP *** [3d Jd Th]
joeyjoejr: bets $10
XxStacks60xX: raises $22 to $32
joeyjoejr: folds

Terrible unless villian is total passive nit. Draws make this an easy re-raise or call and lead out.

Table 'Tekmessa II' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: AcutePoker ($52.30 in chips)
Seat 4: bkgotgame ($307.75 in chips)
Seat 5: aref1981 ($40 in chips)
Seat 6: MightyScrot ($391.40 in chips)
Seat 7: BBKING344 ($185.80 in chips)
Seat 8: Chiren80 ($226 in chips)
Seat 9: joeyjoejr ($333 in chips)
BBKING344: posts small blind $1
Chiren80: posts big blind $2
Johnny Osaka: sits out
narrator123: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [Ah Ac]
joeyjoejr: raises $2 to $4
AcutePoker: folds
bkgotgame: folds
aref1981: folds
MightyScrot: folds
BBKING344: calls $3
Chiren80: calls $2
*** FLOP *** [8h 6h 2s]
BBKING344: checks
Chiren80: checks
joeyjoejr: bets $8
BBKING344: raises $18 to $26
Chiren80: folds
joeyjoejr: folds

Same as last one.
Table 'Verbiest IV' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: sebaaastian ($293.10 in chips)
Seat 2: micula213 ($200 in chips)
Seat 3: VACBlack ($37 in chips)
Seat 4: JLHARLEY43 ($142.95 in chips)
Seat 5: TheLife ($239.40 in chips)
Seat 6: joeyjoejr ($138 in chips)
Seat 7: Hilikus_mike ($335.55 in chips)
Seat 8: cfost28 ($95.65 in chips)
JLHARLEY43: posts small blind $1
TheLife: posts big blind $2
dropkickz: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [7c 7h]
joeyjoejr: raises $4 to $6
Hilikus_mike: folds
cfost28: folds
sebaaastian: folds
micula213: calls $6
VACBlack: folds
JLHARLEY43: folds
TheLife: calls $4
*** FLOP *** [Jd 7s 9d]
TheLife: checks
joeyjoejr: bets $14
micula213: raises $24 to $38
TheLife: folds
joeyjoejr: folds!

OMFG. You just folded a set to a single reraise on a drawy board.

Table 'Polaris VI' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: VACBlack ($46 in chips)
Seat 2: gutter23 ($233.50 in chips)
Seat 3: pokerpoopy ($226.55 in chips)
Seat 4: 4timmy ($369.65 in chips)
Seat 6: cihmi ($333.20 in chips)
Seat 7: joeyjoejr ($200 in chips)
Seat 8: MightyScrot ($201 in chips)
Seat 9: *ALE* ($261.80 in chips)
MightyScrot: posts small blind $1
*ALE*: posts big blind $2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to joeyjoejr [3h 3s]
VACBlack: folds
gutter23: folds
pokerpoopy: folds
4timmy: raises $4 to $6
cihmi: folds
joeyjoejr: calls $6
gutter23 is sitting out
MightyScrot: folds
*ALE*: folds
*** FLOP *** [2d 2s 8c]
4timmy: checks
joeyjoejr: checks
*** TURN *** [2d 2s 8c] [3d]
4timmy: bets $10
joeyjoejr: raises $24 to $34
4timmy: raises $34 to $68
joeyjoejr: folds!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
W. T. F. You have the third nuts and the other two are extremely unlikely here. Easily he could have an over pair or something.
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 10:16am   #6
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Joey, some of those hands are just plain insane. For instance, wtf are you doing folding with 77 and 33 there? These are nitty games, but people do raise two pair/trips, and in the case of the 33 hand, A2 is certainly possible. In fact, the only hand you're really worried about there is 88.

Granted, it is 4timmy, who will probably always have 88 there, but still, how the hell do you fold?! If you're going to fold to the 4-bet on the turn you can't 3-bet - I mean it's crazy to call down there, but at least its better than 3-bet/folding.

The aces/kings hands are bad but not as bad as giving up on sets to the least resistance. Why are you playing low pocket pairs if you're just planning to give up immediately to any resistance when you flop a set? On the 77 hand its even more fucked up, because you don't even have a full buyin and you're bet/folding a set on a board where there are only 3 hands which beat you in the entire distribution (but there are many more which semibluff you or have two pair or a pair+draw).



If I could give one example where it might be *right* to give up on overpairs as easily as you do, I had a pot where I opened for 3x with AA in ep, got called by a 18/17 who 3-bets about 6% and who I had pretty much *never* seen call one of my open-raises preflop in over 1k hands (against TAGs he always folds or 3-bets, the 1% he vpips w/o raising pf is from the odd encounter with minraising donks and such). Another player called from the sb.

Flop comes T52 rainbow. SB checks, I bet out like 4/5ths or more of the pot, and he *flat called* me, which I'd *never* seen him do. PFA was like 7 I think, with no history of calling flop bets. Given there were no draws, and I expect him to raise JJ+, and not float 3 way with 33/44/66/77/88/99, and he never shows up with a random two pair, it was a super easy c/f on the turn when it came an offsuit 6. In that spot, I figure he has a set 95%+ of the time. But not only did I have reliable stats on him, I also had a super dry board that no one could be drawing on.

Those boards are too wet and those players aren't quite robotic raise/folders like the player in queston (or at least, you haven't indicated that they are) and as such, I don't think you can give up immediately. In nitty games its sometimes hard to tell when to give up on overpairs, but surely neither of those spots is an automatic fold.


The QQ hand is fine, depending on the player. If he 3-bets like 5 or 6%, I pop him so long as the minraiser doesn't have a history of minraising monsters preflop. If the 3-bettor 3-bets much less than 5 or 6%, or if the minraiser is likely to be strong, I drop it.


PS - damn you Joey for making me post strategy in what has otherwise become the official Aussiedonk whinge forum.
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Oh, and obviously, TWLLM, we'd all rather you just ruled with an iron fist of nittiness and made all decisions without consultation, but that goes without saying, right?
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 11:24am   #7
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Quit poker. Or stop folding the best hand.

And TWLLM should not be allowed to post HH advice unless it is low-stakes PLO.
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 11:57am   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWLLM View Post
In fact, the only hand you're really worried about there is 88.

Granted, it is 4timmy, who will probably always have 88 there,
Noooooo, nooo noo, from what I've seen of 4timmy thus far he's very aggressive postflop, I've seen him check raise 55 on a K8x board then lead out for 2/3 pot on the turn. He sensed weakness in the 33 hand and has acted on it, you're crushing his range.

QQ hand is a squeeze play a lot of the time because he's on the button and mini-raising with a MP call regularly induces this sort of thing. He would have c-bet any flop with any 2 but you've got to be in good shape with queens.

The 77 hand is pretty ghastly, the AA and KK are read dependant I guess, and image dependant....dunno.

But yes pretty hideous series of hands, maybe alter your mini-raise PF as standard, it's getting you into trouble.
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 1:45pm   #9
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In my defense those the only 2 sets I have folded over the half million hands I played this year. And obviosly its just because those two guys are the biggest nits ever

I have Micula at 9.73/6.35 over 20000 hands and he pretty much never has anything but 99 or JJ there.

4timmy plays 9.53/8.16 over 15000 hands and yeah he has 88 and doesnt plays hands with a deuce in them. I'm fairly sure he thinks that I have 33 and doesnt care so I folded
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Old Mar 10, 2009, 2:17pm   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ggnh View Post
This obviously shows just how much I don't know about ring games...
from the responses and discussion it is worse than I feared...

Time to start playing more flash games and less poker....

On a complete side note it was nice to see some strategy talk

thank you one and all
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<Notjitsu> you are like a good luck charm for the rest of the table.
<Gus>I think Id cc 2 times. I hate all options. I hate that hand. I even hate poker, sometimes.
<Rabidcow>too much collusion in heads up sit n goes u never know what the other guy has for cards, becarefull
<Ozone> I dunno... fuckin' poker
<Kc>this one is much closer to good advice but still introduces some unnecessary shortcuts across the grass for us to cover our boots in dog shit.
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