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Old May 11, 2010, 10:24pm   #1
Superpasha69
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Default bad bluff?

Heya!

One common problem i have is my inability to bluff, bellow is one example of what just happened to me, i got lucky at the end but as a bluff it was crap...i was big blind and the table is pretty pasive so when the dealer tryed to steal my blinds i reraised him as i saw him make few bluff b4...obv it didnt work and he called me.

In general how can i be more convincing with bluffs?

Thanks in advance



PokerStars Game #43951306187: Tournament #311010692, $2.50+$0.25 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2010/05/11 18:10:37 ET
Table '311010692 191' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: Full_Nerea (5140 in chips)
Seat 2: Pickelfart (2775 in chips)
Seat 3: Stockman77 (7040 in chips)
Seat 4: Superpasha69 (8105 in chips)
Seat 5: cherryoakin (4625 in chips)
Seat 6: OnTiltChef (12005 in chips)
Seat 7: ABCtheNUTZ (3900 in chips)
Seat 8: ILTG-GT (9320 in chips)
Seat 9: uvrays (11262 in chips)
Stockman77: posts small blind 75
Superpasha69: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Superpasha69 [2d 3d]
Stockman77 said, "and i fold a str8for the 4th time"
cherryoakin: folds
OnTiltChef: folds
ABCtheNUTZ: folds
ILTG-GT: folds
uvrays: folds
Full_Nerea: folds
Pickelfart: folds
Stockman77: raises 150 to 300
Superpasha69: raises 600 to 900
Stockman77: calls 600
*** FLOP *** [5h 3h Td]
Stockman77: bets 450
Superpasha69: calls 450
*** TURN *** [5h 3h Td] [5d]
Stockman77: checks
cherryoakin is disconnected
Superpasha69: bets 600
cherryoakin is connected
Stockman77: calls 600
*** RIVER *** [5h 3h Td 5d] [7d]
Stockman77: bets 600
Superpasha69: raises 1200 to 1800
Stockman77: calls 1200
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Superpasha69: shows [2d 3d] (a flush, Ten high)
Stockman77: mucks hand
Superpasha69 collected 7500 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 7500 | Rake 0
Board [5h 3h Td 5d 7d]
Seat 1: Full_Nerea folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Pickelfart (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Stockman77 (small blind) mucked [Tc 2c]
Seat 4: Superpasha69 (big blind) showed [2d 3d] and won (7500) with a flush, Ten high
Seat 5: cherryoakin folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: OnTiltChef folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: ABCtheNUTZ folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: ILTG-GT folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: uvrays folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Last edited by Superpasha69; May 11, 2010 at 11:45pm.
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Old May 12, 2010, 2:02am   #2
killcrazy
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bluffing effectively is all about timing, recognising when your opponent likely doesn't have a hand strong enough to call. i would advise against trying to bluff at all at the stakes you're playing. you'll be a winner playing tight solid poker and bluffs are less effective against bad players who will be inclined to look you up weak or call to "keep you honest".

as i say, effective bluffing is built on strong hand reading, so for the moment, practise your hand reading skills, always try to put your opponent on a hand (or more commonly a range of possible hands) and see how often you're right when it gets turned over.

Kc
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Old May 12, 2010, 5:46am   #3
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Quote:
One common problem i have is my inability to bluff
This isn't your problem. Your problem is that you tried to bluff, despite having no idea if it'd work or not. As Kc said, bluffing isn't hmm, he he might not have a hand maybe I can steal, it's about putting him on a range of hands and seeing whether or not a bluff is more EV than simply calling/folding.

For now, learn how to hand read and play solid poker. Then, when you can think about what hands the villain would take this line with, you can think about when you should bluff.
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Old May 12, 2010, 4:23pm   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killcrazy View Post
i would advise against trying to bluff at all at the stakes you're playing. you'll be a winner playing tight solid poker

Kc

is this for cash games or tournamnet play? because with cash games i realised the is no point bluffing but in tournamnets the blinds eat u up so i try to bluff for blind steal..or would u recoment stealing with half decent hand?
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Old May 13, 2010, 1:33am   #5
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Originally Posted by Superpasha69 View Post
is this for cash games or tournamnet play? because with cash games i realised the is no point bluffing but in tournamnets the blinds eat u up so i try to bluff for blind steal..or would u recoment stealing with half decent hand?
There is a difference between bluffing and playing looser. If you are getting destroyed by the blinds, you need to loosen up your ranges that you make decisions. This isn't the same as bluffing. This means that you'll probably loosen up some starting hand requirements, but also could mean you loosen up your bet/call range. Aka normally maybe you fold second pair good kicker on a flop, and you still had value there against said villain.

It could also mean that you are playing tight but not getting value when you have the better of it. Look for spots where a worse hand will call a bet from you. There are plenty.

And it isn't that there isn't a point to blind stealing or bluffing, there is in both cash games and tournaments. The point is that you don't currently have the ability to differentiate between good spots and bad spots, so your bluffs will often cost you money in the long run. When you can read hands better and guess an opponents range, you'll do better at bluffing and can incorporate it into your play.
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Old May 13, 2010, 3:19am   #6
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Originally Posted by Superpasha69 View Post
is this for cash games or tournamnet play? because with cash games i realised the is no point bluffing but in tournamnets the blinds eat u up so i try to bluff for blind steal..or would u recoment stealing with half decent hand?
both.

blind steals and continuation bets aren't really the same as full blooded bluffs. they are always made with virtually no information based on pure math. you should frequently continuation bet, for instance, because whatever your opponent calls your preflop raise with is going to hit the flop less than 2/3 of the time. so if you bet half the pot on the flop, you will only need to win the pot 1/3 of the time to be profitable, which you will.

Kc
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Old Jun 16, 2010, 1:51pm   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killcrazy View Post
both.

blind steals and continuation bets aren't really the same as full blooded bluffs. they are always made with virtually no information based on pure math. you should frequently continuation bet, for instance, because whatever your opponent calls your preflop raise with is going to hit the flop less than 2/3 of the time. so if you bet half the pot on the flop, you will only need to win the pot 1/3 of the time to be profitable, which you will.

Kc
Nice explanation kc!
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Old Jun 18, 2010, 8:55pm   #8
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Very good explanation KC, I will say at these levels that focusing on cbets and blind stealing will be more profitable than stone cold bluffs just because so many players at this level marry their hands and call you down to the river which makes value bets very effective also.
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Old Jun 23, 2010, 1:31pm   #9
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Very good explanation KC, I will say at these levels that focusing on cbets and blind stealing will be more profitable than stone cold bluffs just because so many players at this level marry their hands and call you down to the river which makes value bets very effective also.
I think it's in the players strategy, being profitable in blind bets or going all the way down to the river.
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Old Jun 25, 2010, 11:44pm   #10
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Hi I'm new here, liked the Pokertips Glossary and noticed good posts from several forum members, so decided to join.

For OP, I'd advice to pick up slightly better hands for light preflop 3betting. I mean, cause you are not good at bluffing it's better to play hands that have several benefits - can make decent pair, a good draw, or maybe with a blocker like Axs.

That 23s has not too much of a potential, so I'd better folded it pre. If I decide to 3bet I simply hope he folds right away, and if he calls I hope for a miracle. Once he leads the flop I'm sure you are beat almost always and he won't easily fold, and even if he bluffs you are not too far ahead, so no point in messing around, fold to his donkbet.
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