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Old Oct 30, 2010, 2:32am   #1
joeyjoejoejr
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Default Exploitative vs GTO play

This is something I have been thinking a lot about it.

I was just playing a HU match against an apparent reg.

After playing around a 100 hands fairlly standardish with normal size cbets that fluctate a bit in size depending on the board. I decided to randomly increase the size to 95% on a dry board, and followed up with big turn bet and bombed the river , both bricks.

I did this because I though this opponent would interpet the sizing change for strength and perhaps make a biggish fold. The idea was to get him to think I was thinking his calling frequency on the flop was not dependent on my size and thus I would only cbet big and barrel through with made hand.

Thus I gave up some information about my hand (something was clearly up) but I did so as a fake tell inorder to exploit what I thought he would be thinking. The risk of course is that he goes to the next level.

Then 60 hands later I might increase the size again either again as a bluff or this time for value if I thought he now would interpet it differently.

Obviously I can come up with tons of other spots where one could use a potentially exploitative play in order to level your opponent into a wrong decision. Basically make more decisions based on psychology rather then GTO math.

I have feeling getting plays like this to work is what seperates a slightly winning grinder to huge winner and is what makes extremly high level poker very hard to teach.

The alternative is to strive for balanced unexploitable play against tough players and look only to exploit fish and weaker regulars. I definitely need to work on both aspects of the game but does anybody have any thoughts or advice on this topic?
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Old Oct 30, 2010, 6:37am   #2
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i think this is really just another example of knowing your opponent, and knowing how he will interpret you changing up your strategy, then changing it again when you anticipate he has cottoned on to what you're doing. this to me is a question of experience, feel and intuition, i'm not sure what there is any of us can say about it that will be of any use to anyone else.

except that the optimal situation to be in is one where you are underbetting with cbets and getting him to fold reading you for strength ("he is trying to milk me i fold"), and betting big with made hands getting him to pay off reading you for weakness ("he is trying to push me out of the pot, i call/raise/stackoff"). this would be the strategy i aim to employ most of the time, spending just enough time employing other strategies to keep this one effective.

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Old Oct 31, 2010, 10:45pm   #3
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just play well I dunno what else you wanna hear

if you can induce mistakes by betting weird sizes that's great. it's not like it's clear what sizing is GTO anyway.. betting pot on dry flop may have merits even in a balanced strategy. the 2/3 cbet size is not something has been calculated it's just the standard and may very well be wrong in most spots.
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Old Nov 01, 2010, 2:21am   #4
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Originally Posted by BubbleBoy View Post
just play well I dunno what else you wanna hear

if you can induce mistakes by betting weird sizes that's great. it's not like it's clear what sizing is GTO anyway.. betting pot on dry flop may have merits even in a balanced strategy. the 2/3 cbet size is not something has been calculated it's just the standard and may very well be wrong in most spots.
I am sure your right about large non-standard bets on dry boards actually could be GTO in spots where your opponent never has a strong hand and you can. (Say betting 1.2 times pot on all streets after you raise in EP and he flats in SB and the flop is 222)

Basically I am asking what you think my primary thought process should be?

Either - what can I do this particular hand at this particular time in order to induce a mistake.

Or my range here is x and his is x. I can bet for value x and my bluffing range is x.

Would you rather play a opponent that is insanely well balanced or one that is constantly trying to get into your head with non-standard sizing and lines?
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Old Nov 03, 2010, 10:19am   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeyjoejoejr View Post
Either - what can I do this particular hand at this particular time in order to induce a mistake.

Or my range here is x and his is x. I can bet for value x and my bluffing range is x.
that's a good question

the way It ought to be done imo is this:

first, you come up with some good approximation of the ranges and construct some good GTO strategies for them in your head. Then you look where actual hand belongs. If your hand belong to the part which is a clear bet, you bet, process ends here. If your hand belongs to a part where it's probably a bet, but other options are reasonable as well, you go to step 2

so secondly, you consider your opponent. how will he respond to a bet? to a check? to a big bet? If you come up with something like "he will make a lot of mistakes when I check", maybe that hand that theoretically is a bet now becomes a check.

in summary, play GTO-ish, but with hands that are closish, adjust to your opponent.



the way I do it at the table:

for every hand there is some standard play as in "first" above, but it's not derived from theory, rather from experience. the second part, adjusting to the player, comes kinda intuitive as well. when there is a very loose player in the hand I will value bet weaker hands obviously. but it's done without thinking about theory, just whether I think it's good or not.

the only time I really think about a hand from the whole range on range perspective, like you ought to, is when post processing a hand. Or when looking for excuses to fold/call in a close spot. Like "I have the nut blocker, it's the best bluff catcher I could have".
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Old Nov 13, 2010, 1:26am   #6
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Originally Posted by PokerChips View Post
Get a good read on your opponent then play according to that.
easy game
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