FanDuel

THE FORUMS


German ForumsGeneral DiscussionStrategyFrench Forum

Go Back   PokerTips.org Forums > General Discussion > PokerTips Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Jan 31, 2013, 10:54pm   #1
jimmyG
Flop Artist
 
jimmyG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ontario canada
Posts: 52
Reputation: 0
jimmyG is an unknown quantity at this point
Default How do I get deep in the money?? ps

Got question for you pros ( or killcrazy lol ) .Im having problems on pokerstars getting deep in the money . A few Examples that are typical.... 1 im 2 hours into the big 5.50 and i have Kh Qd blinds are 1000 ,2000 or so...Im fisrt to act and raise 3X to 6000 get one caller. flop comes 7h 9h Q h...im first and bet the pot ..he raises allin and I call with my 16000 left ..he has Aq off ..no heart comes and Im out ..then I goto the big 27.50 late and blind are 200 400 ..first hand i get pocket aces and raise ..One caller re-raises allin I call he flops a flush and im gone ..This type of hand happens all the time to me ....wth am I doing wrong...thanks
jimmyG est déconnecté   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Don't like this ad? Register to make it go away!

Old Feb 01, 2013, 5:14pm   #2
darryl
Still can't quit day job.
 
darryl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: chicago area
Posts: 1,171
Reputation: 1220
darryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud ofdarryl has much to be proud of
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

You can play perfect and not got deep. It takes a lot of luck too. If you get your money all in with Aces preflop, you played correctly. Just make good decisions and it will happen eventually. If you are unsure about a situation, post it and everyone will try to help.

-d
__________________
__________________
AFPP Supporter
Supporting a friendlier pokertips.org since 2008
darryl est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 01, 2013, 9:31pm   #3
jimmyG
Flop Artist
 
jimmyG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ontario canada
Posts: 52
Reputation: 0
jimmyG is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

thanks darryl..im trying a real tight method ..avoid allins unless i have the nuts and climb the ladder with chip shots
jimmyG est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 06, 2013, 12:41pm   #4
GoldfishUltraDeluxe
Grinder
 
GoldfishUltraDeluxe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Online [micro|low]stakes cashgame, SnG or MTT
Posts: 790
Reputation: 372
GoldfishUltraDeluxe is just really niceGoldfishUltraDeluxe is just really niceGoldfishUltraDeluxe is just really niceGoldfishUltraDeluxe is just really nice
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

I was just about to post an answer when I realized the post might be so good that I had to absorb what I was just writing and make sure that I actually do implement all of it in my game...

For now, just recall to never lose an all-in against a bigger stack. If you manage to follow this rule throughout an entire tournament you will take it down
__________________
Standard.....no, wait, WTF is going on here?
GoldfishUltraDeluxe est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 07, 2013, 4:33pm   #5
jimmyG
Flop Artist
 
jimmyG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ontario canada
Posts: 52
Reputation: 0
jimmyG is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

thanks ...found that out the hard way a few times lol ...last night again right on the bubble .^&%%$&%@%#!Q$#!T lol...note self ..avoid bigstack if possible before the bubble
jimmyG est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 07, 2013, 8:05pm   #6
SwoopAE
CAPITAO
 
SwoopAE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 13,258
Reputation: 4037
SwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond repute
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

Play each hand on its merits, playing 'tight' or 'loose' as an overall strategy is a mistake. A lot of the statements you are making show a lack of understanding of the game. I would recommend reading some poker books by reputable players and possibly getting a subscription to a training video site, or watching some of the many free training videos available if you don't want to subscribe to one.

If you can afford it, coaching would help a lot, or if you have any friends who are better than you who can coach you for free like I do for a lot of my friends that may help you fix your thought process also

Additionally, even once you become a winning player (it is unlikely that you are a winning player right now), long losing or breakeven stretched are possible in tournament poker due to variance. For example, i've made around 250k from MTTs over the past 5 years and I would probably be ranked somewhere in the #100-500 region for all of the MTT players in the world putting me well within the top 1%, but I still had a 3000 game breakeven stretch last year (while making something like 50k overall). Think about that for a minute, three thousand tournaments. How many tournaments do you play per week? Downswings can last a long time even if you are very skilled.

Also, try not to think in a results-oriented manner.

For example, I had a guy check-raise all in with six left on the final table of the 265ko today and I called with top pair top kicker. He had top pair with a worse kicker and sucked out to eliminate me from the tournament. That does not mean I should have folded, that means I played my hand correctly, and variance happens. In another tournament, if I got it in with an overpair against a set on the flop and sucked out by hitting a higher set, that does not mean I played the hand correctly, that means I played the hand incorrectly (assuming he had correct odds to setmine - learn about what implied odds means) and because I got lucky and went on to win the tournament doesn't mean I played the hand correctly in that instance.

Of course, any time you have a question feel free to post it here and we'll answer it for you.
__________________
Chat Monitor (Support): SwoopAE has lost their chat privilege for 5 minutes. Spamming the table is prohibited.


Last edited by SwoopAE; Feb 07, 2013 at 8:07pm.
SwoopAE est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 07, 2013, 10:10pm   #7
killcrazy
Apex Predator
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Edinburgh, UK
Posts: 10,218
Reputation: 8118
killcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond reputekillcrazy has a reputation beyond repute
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwoopAE View Post
Play each hand on its merits, playing 'tight' or 'loose' as an overall strategy is a mistake.
what swoop is saying here is that poker, especially tournament poker, is a dynamic game where the variables are constantly changing. if you're married to playing tight, or loose, you're going to make mistakes that can cost you significant value.

it's not that you shouldn't have an overall strategy (and for OP, for the moment, we would both suggest a tighter, more conservative approach to the game until you get to pushbot territory) but that should be where your decision making process starts, not where it ends.

incidentally i think coaching would be a waste of resources at this stage; coaching is expensive, and OP isn't at a stage where he needs one on one time with someone who can look at his game and address his specific, small weaknesses because he invariably has much bigger holes that need to be patched up first.

so @OP buy some books, read those books, read those books again, and perhaps a third time. this represents a much better return on investment.

Kc
__________________
"Blah blah blah KC is right" - Ozone
killcrazy est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 07, 2013, 10:26pm   #8
jimmyG
Flop Artist
 
jimmyG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ontario canada
Posts: 52
Reputation: 0
jimmyG is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Thanks vm for the responce swoopAE ! I feel privileged that someone of you caliber replied to my question and thats one reason I joined this site .

let me qualify a few things I said ..first I mentined playing tighter because Im generally a "loose" player and know the term well lol. Also the mistake i mentioned was about getting knocked out just before the bubble by the big stack...He out stacked me 4 to 1 chips . I was under the gun with A9 and shoved allin ..he called with AQ . Now lesson learned : raise if your going too instead of allin with a hand like A rag then go from the flop ,otherwise fold. Please correct me if thats wrong ??

I hear and know well what you said about long droughts ..i call them slumps ..but If you stick to your game and play the odds and percentages correct you will get past it .

Now tell me how you would have felt If you called that "check raise"allin the way you did and saw that he had flopped a set ...Was your play still the correct one ...risking your tournament on just top pair ...like the hungry fish i am for poker knowledge Id love to hear more from you on this ..thanks vm ...ps ..is that your online name on PS ..love to watch you or maybe even try a heads up ..thanks again
jimmyG est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 11, 2013, 6:55am   #9
SwoopAE
CAPITAO
 
SwoopAE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 13,258
Reputation: 4037
SwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond reputeSwoopAE has a reputation beyond repute
This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile! This member received this PokerTips Exclamation Mark for one of a number of reasons: blogging, winning a contest, contributing great content, etc. Keep an eye out for chances to receive one of these by your profile!
Default

Thanks vm for the responce swoopAE ! I feel privileged that someone of you caliber replied to my question and thats one reason I joined this site .

You're welcome

let me qualify a few things I said ..first I mentined playing tighter because Im generally a "loose" player and know the term well lol.

You need to start thinking in terms of aggressive and passive as well as loose and tight, and a bunch of other things. A poker book will explain those concepts for you. For example, there is a big difference between a loose aggressive player (who may be good or bad) and a loose passive player, who is almost always going to be bad at poker

Also the mistake i mentioned was about getting knocked out just before the bubble by the big stack...He out stacked me 4 to 1 chips . I was under the gun with A9 and shoved allin ..he called with AQ .

How many big blinds did you have? How many big blinds did other people have? It may or may not have been a mistake, I would need to see the hand history to know and explain how it was or was not a mistake. I can even do math to show you why, but ranges and nash charts and whatnot are for when you have a better grasp of basic concepts


Now lesson learned : raise if your going too instead of allin with a hand like A rag then go from the flop ,otherwise fold. Please correct me if thats wrong ??

That's not the sort of thing you need to be thinking about right now. Jamming preflop can be fine, or it can be bad. So can taking flops. Without specific examples, it's hard to explain why. If you posted some actual hand histories which you can copy from the software, i'll go into more detail analysing them


I hear and know well what you said about long droughts ..i call them slumps ..but If you stick to your game and play the odds and percentages correct you will get past it .

Assuming you are a winning player, yes. You are almost certainly a losing player right now. You need to accept that, and work out how to improve so that you can become a winning player. The first step is to realise that you are not very good at poker yet. You can be though, with time, study, effort and practice. I was a losing player when when I started as were most people who are now elite players. It took me several months to be a breakeven player and a year or so to become a winner, the two years or so until I was considered 'good' at tournament poker. 92% or so of all players are losing players. Also, the common term for a slump as you call it is 'downswing'.

Now tell me how you would have felt If you called that "check raise"allin the way you did and saw that he had flopped a set ...

If my play was correct on average (meaning if I did it 100 times i'd beat the range of hands he has) then i'd think 'oh well he has a set this time but my play was fine'. If I decided that running the scenario out many times I would lose more often than win, then I would be disappointed in myself for making a mistake and would work to correct my thought process so I make the right decision next time. Being results oriented based off what happens in a single hand is a bad thought process, you need to learn to think in terms of ranges.

Was your play still the correct one ...risking your tournament on just top pair

The answer here depends on how your opponent plays, his stack size,

I've risked my tournament life all-in preflop in the aussie millions main event with 42 suited and busted in a spot I would take again because I get the fold often enough that going all-in was correct, and i've made mistakes not folding QQ preflop in big live tournaments in a spot where the hand is basically garbage since my opponents can only have KK and AA in that spot. Hand strength is variable, depending on a number of factors, top pair can be an amazing hand that you're trying to trap with, or a bluff catcher, or absolute garbage or anything inbetween depending on the situation.


...like the hungry fish i am for poker knowledge Id love to hear more from you on this ..thanks vm ...ps ..is that your online name on PS ..love to watch you or maybe even try a heads up ..thanks again

My name on Pokerstars is Talerric. I won the Sunday Second Chance today if you want to look over some of my hand histories and ask questions about why I played a hand the way I did if you don't understand why I did something. Alternatively, you can get your hand histories, find the ones you think you made a mistake in and ask people like me and KC to comment on them. SwoopAE is my Full Tilt name btw, since I mostly played at full tilt when I signed up to Ptips a few years ago.
__________________
Chat Monitor (Support): SwoopAE has lost their chat privilege for 5 minutes. Spamming the table is prohibited.


Last edited by SwoopAE; Feb 12, 2013 at 12:23am.
SwoopAE est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Old Feb 14, 2013, 10:18pm   #10
jimmyG
Flop Artist
 
jimmyG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ontario canada
Posts: 52
Reputation: 0
jimmyG is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Thanks very much Swoop lots of good food in your comments, Im a sponge lol .Ive been playing for 6 years now and have won my share of small tournys but never got to serious on tiger gaming lol...what Im trying to do just of late is take the game to a higher level.So books i will read (if you can name a couple) I think I have lots of hand to hand combat experiance and feel I can do well . My worst fear is realizing that I may not have what it takes..and just get slotted into the "92 percentile"..on the topic of pocket queens ..folded them preflop in a live event after I sniffed out pocket Aces from a 3bet across from me..went on to 3rd in a room of 50 for 900 bucks...also made a fablulous play with pocket Ks against pocket Qs,after I called a 3bet raise and flopped K22 for a boat...the play from that was a pretty standard check raise allin since I was short stacked and for him to call me meant just another 1000 chips
jimmyG est déconnecté   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 7:51am. vBulletin 3.7.4 Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.